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Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=rtLUBbRsu-s

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Your your mic's not on so she can't hear you. >> Good evening. >> Dean, I think you're muted. >> Good evening. The Red Bank Historic Preservation Commission will hold a regular meeting on Wednesday, July 15th,

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2026 at 7:00 p.m. at 90 Monmouth Street, Red Bank, New Jersey. Adequate notice of this meeting has been posted at Borough Hall, filed with the Borough Clerk, and provided to the Asbury Park Press and the Two River Times. The Commission has maintained a policy cutoff hour of 8:30 p.m. for its

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hearings. Please uh rise if you can for the Pledge of Allegiance. May we have a roll call? >> Louis Alamariani? >> Present. >> Uh Marjorie Cavalier? >> Present. >> Liam Collins, absent. Paul Cagno? >> Present.

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>> Karen Smelscoff? >> Present. >> He's waving, yes. >> Anthony Satoro, absent. Michael White, absent. Betsy Balera? >> Present. >> Why can't I hear anybody? >> I see her.

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>> Yeah, her mic was on. >> Oh, she's muted. >> Volume's on. Should be good. All right, present and >> [clears throat] >> Matthew Cummings, present. Absent. >> Absent. >> Go ahead. >> Okay, uh

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meeting minutes at uh we have the past two meetings uh minutes to approve. We were the May minutes were not yet available at the June meeting. Um and they were included in the meeting materials. So,

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uh I take it I hope that you've had a chance to review them. Do I have May I have a motion to approve them? >> I don't think I was here. >> No, I wasn't here that either. Karen or >> Karen and Betsy, you'd have to um

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motion for the >> May meeting. >> Oh, I >> May meeting. >> May meeting. >> All right, Karen's raising her hand. So, she's making the motion. >> And Betsy would have to vote. >> No, we can't hear you. >> Is it us? >> I don't know.

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>> Yeah, it's you. We're at optimum volume. >> All right, what about Betsy? She's here. >> oh, yeah, I'm here. I'll second. >> is it me? Hold on. Where are we? Betsy, can you hear me? >> I can hear you. Can can you hear me?

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>> I can't. Yeah, we hear each other. >> Okay, okay, we're good. >> Sorry. >> Okay. Good. All right, so Betsy can second. >> Yeah, I'll second. >> All right. >> Okay, um Luis Almarini?

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>> Approve. As to >> Is this for both minutes? >> Approve as to both. >> Yeah, let's just do them both. Oh. Okay, that's fine. So, we'll do the first. >> So, I would say approve as to both. >> Okay.

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Yeah, I would think we could do it and you just abstain from the other one. >> All right, so Okay. Okay I'm Are you going to call our names out? >> Yes, um so Lou, yes. Marjorie,

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>> abstain from May, >> and yes for June. >> Paul Cagno. Hey. Abs- Abstain for June. Karen Schmaltz Scott. >> Yes. >> And Betsy Balera.

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>> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Okay. Moving to reports of the committee starting with minor works. >> The minor works committee met. Um, we discussed the following applications. We

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discussed 20 Washing Watch Sorry. 20 Washington Street, which was for window replacement and a section of the siding to replace like for like. Um, we approved that one. And then, um, 33 Washington Street, that

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was a replacement for an asphalt roof with an asphalt roof. Um, and that was also approved. 31 Washington Street and 40 3A Broad Street, 137-139

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Broad Street, and 42 Broad Mama Street were signage applications and those were all approved. >> That's it. Uh, no River Center report since Anthony is not available for this meeting.

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Um, historic sites designation. >> Um, we did not have a meeting, but, um, for for number four, I I do have some things to mention. I don't know if anybody else on that committee is here. Liam, we don't have

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Betsy. Betsy, do you have anything on on the four certified local government designation? >> Um, I wasn't informed of anything um new. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> All right. Um, so

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one of the things and and I guess if this could be mentioned in the minutes, we were talking about one of the requirements is every member on the commission has to demonstrate that they had certain training during the year. So, we have to make an effort

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to to document that. So, when I had occasion to talk to Steven at um the conference in June, he mentioned that he has done presentations

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uh to HPCs who have been applying for CLGs. And so, there are now just to update the last time I asked about the number in New Jersey, there were like 33, but now like 2 years later, there's now

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45 uh CLGs in in New Jersey. So, I asked one of the reviewers um how do how do they how do they judge training? So, can be pretty fluid. It's it's better if everybody had the same training or we've

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established training for new members. But, one of the things that Steven says is he's done presentations for about you know, $500 that could be recorded here and then people who were not in attendance could then view that

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and that could be counted. So, one of the So, some of the things he's done for other communities are general design guidelines, which we've already handled. Um, specific number two, additions and new construction in historic districts,

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which is interestingly enough on the agenda tonight. Demolition demolition reviews, which would involve that he would have to customize that for Red Bank, and Michelle should probably be there for that training session.

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And also how to evaluate composite and imitated materials in historic districts. So, with the exception of the demolition review, which would require more research on his part um

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he would say $500 to do that training, to cover travel expenses and his presentation. So, and that he would be available to do that training in October and November. He's pretty busy now. So, I just wanted to

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get a sense for how people felt about establishing a training session for October or November of some sort, if not with Steven, something that we all would participate

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with. What do people think? >> Have we looked into whether >> Oh, okay. >> Come on. Have we looked into whether there are any national

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nationally available online resources >> Mhm. >> uh for training to service groups like us nationally. I and I ask because then it would have scale, and it might

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be something you could do online. They may have record keeping. >> Mhm. Well, I could just say as a member of the library board that the New Jersey Library Association does have training online available for for New Jersey,

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but I don't know if nationally it would work because just like I've talked to HPCs just this other week in West Virginia and Ohio. >> The laws are different. >> The laws are different, the ordinances are different. Um but it is possible

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um to include things like like I did on on my travels talking to local a HPCs and going uh on excursions for like an hour or 2 hours or whatever to look at what they're doing in their communities, but I think that they would also look for

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some kind of formal training for everybody on the board and we've we've talked about trying to come up with something for new board members, but I think that everybody between now and when we make application has to demonstrate some kind of training that

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they participated in. So >> Yeah, I would say I think it's a good idea with Stephen. All the topics that you you just listed there are already contained in the guidelines. Um so if it's to the extent it's repetitive, I don't know what

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good that training would be necessarily cuz we already have a copy of what we paid him to do for us. But he's an expert and I was very impressed with him, so hearing from him for 500 bucks to me is worth >> Yeah. >> the effort and the cost. >> If it's 500 bucks covering a group of people, then that's >> Yeah.

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>> phenomenal. >> Seems good and maybe we could also suggest some topics that >> Is there a minimum number of hours annually? >> Not that I mean, Liam would be the one to ask and I and for sure we could we could try and remember that for the next

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agenda meeting and hopefully he will participate. >> Yeah. >> Uh and but I didn't see any like number of hours that needed to be done. Um and as I mentioned, you could obviously supplement if you've done anything independently.

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>> Mhm. Mhm. >> And so that brings me to the second point to remind people uh to submit resumes. Like everybody on the on the commission has to submit a resume.

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Um I sent one I sent mine to to Liam. I don't know if if that was sent out to everybody else on the commission. Shauna? >> Yeah. >> No, but I Is that's Would people want to see mine as a sample of how it should

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look or can we do that? >> Can I just What is the resume for? >> For the CLG. They need to see a resume like which which basically says what How were you appointed to the board? You know, like what what is your ABC and

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then your resume and then how you're involved in the community and and to defend how what what you are ABC, you know, that kind of stuff. So that's what I'm asking. I mean I I went through the requirements and did a sample. I don't know that this is

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the It's a draft, you know, but can we send out my sample? Is anyone interested in seeing it or do you just want to try it on your own or >> I'd like to see it so there's consistency. That's >> Yeah, that's what I'm

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All right, so I will send it again to Shauna. >> I can send it. >> Okay. >> Liam did also send a template to follow. >> All right, so >> and >> Okay, good. That's >> Uh Audrey's. >> Okay.

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All right, um so so that's all I have for that report and then I will be handling under old business number two. >> Okay, why don't we do them in order?

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>> make a comment real quick? I've just been browsing. There are several online courses, one from National, Rutgers has them for New Jersey, and then New Jersey Historical Preservation has them. And so I think that there's no problem with

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checking out what we would want to do if we want to do what we want. >> There are credits and and you could get credits at at the conferences, but I think you have to pay for those. >> What do we want the credits for? I mean >> Like the classes, I think I think to do that you

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need to pay for that one credit and a half or something. >> Oh, yeah, I I'm yeah. >> Yeah, I >> Some of them you don't have to pay if you're not taking a credit. I mean >> I know. >> would have to look it up. I just glanced. So, um >> Sure did look at. >> Okay.

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>> Yeah, I just looked quickly and it looked like through Rutgers, Camden, and then Historic Preservation, they do um it seems like every semester they offer some courses and it looked like they were about $150

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for a few weeks of online um evening instruction. Actually, it looked like there was one uh that was starting this evening for several weeks. So, there are there are options certainly. >> There's also the Advisory Council on Historic Preservation, which is hca

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achp.gov, and they have training. So, that's the national one, and then Yeah. >> What? >> webinars. >> All right, well, maybe I you know, I I still don't know how we work these emails if we could share this

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information or not. Does that come through Shauna and then to us? >> Well, I'll send mine to Shauna. I'll see what I have. >> All right, well, maybe if the two of you could, you know, copy and paste and send it to Shauna and then we could she could

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disseminate it to the other people on the commission. But we really have to jump on this soon. >> Are there some interesting class? >> Okay. All right. That's it. >> Okay. >> Okay.

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>> We can now turn to 65 Washington Street. Welcome. Um Is that on? >> Yeah. >> Okay, great. >> I think I'll take a picture. We have seen it slide around the board. >> Chairman, I don't know what's the best place to place this is where everybody

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can see. >> Yeah, but we he's going to have to turn it around for them. >> know what this is. >> Uh if you No no. >> Oh, no. I can talk. >> Oh, oh, okay. >> Oh, you can talk. Okay. Wait, you have the camera thing.

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Well, Mr. Chairman, members of the the board I'm going to come before you. Uh we're talking about the property on 65 um 65 Washington Street. This property is actually located in the Washington

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Street Historic District. Um, so, uh, the, um, my client, Mrs. Breslow, have purchased the property uh, fairly recently. Uh, there was a garage that was on this property before. That was removed and was no

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longer there when they purchased it. So, they would like to build, um, a one-car garage in the back, similar to what was there before. Uh, the the building itself, the existing house itself, and the garage as well,

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uh, was kind of in the Italianate style. And, um, but it does have some Queen Anne influence when you look when you look at the porch and some of the detailing in the cornices and the eaves. But, for the most part, the house is very symmetrical. It has long, thin windows.

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It does have some steep roofs. And the garage to replicate you know, that design as much as possible, in that style as much as possible. Uh, and we do believe that it'll be very homogeneous with the existing structure. The first

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drawing I'm showing you right now is my drawing called SP1. And that shows the survey of the existing property the way it is now. All that I'm referring to in the front, um, is the actual existing dwelling.

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And in the rear, on the right south corner, uh, would be the location that we would like to propose the garage. Currently, there is a driveway that runs along the south side property line. And that would end up being extended a little bit and that

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would service the garage itself. We have, uh, done some calculations with regards to coverage, uh, and you know, other aspects of the zoning and there is a maximum building coverage of 40% allowed in this district. And with the new garage, we're only going to be at

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28.19, so we're far below the you know, the coverage percentage. And we will adhere to all the other setback requirements according to zoning. So, there's plenty of room there uh to make that all work. >> Excuse me one second. Sean, is this going to the zoning board?

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>> Um was the side yard setback on your drawing uh 5.5? Isn't there aren't we 6 ft uh for a garage? >> I mean, that's I thought it was 5.5, but if it's 6, we just move it 6. It's not going to be a problem. >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I just pointed it out. >> My intention is not to go to zoning, you

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know what I mean? We obviously got to get zoning approval, but we're not want to have any variance situation. >> Not looking for variance. That's what >> Yeah, so if it's I we read 5.5. >> It's not your setback. >> Yeah. >> But if it's 6, then it'll be 6. It's not, you know, if that's not >> That's just my recollection that it's 6.

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It's either 6 or 8. >> I don't >> When I built one, it was 8. >> Yeah, it's either 6 or 8. >> So, in New Jersey, the separation distances are 5 to 10 depending on the town. >> Right. So, in Red Bank, it's either 6 or 8. >> Yeah.

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>> Yeah, but this is for accessory building, so the setbacks for the accessory building is obviously different than the regular zone. >> talking about the fire and like fire and life safety codes in New Jersey separation distances. >> Okay, here. Um so, for the accessory

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structure in a RB zone, it's five. >> Five. >> It's five. Okay. >> Yeah, so 5.5 is >> So, then you're good. >> Yeah. Okay. I mean, anyway, you know, whatever it was, you know, we're going to adhere to it. That's all. I think it's um the next drawing I want to show you really is the architectural drawings. It's A1.0.

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Uh and uh what this is is just shows the size of the garage basically being 24 deep by 14 ft wide. Again, one-car garage, a little bit of storage for some tools and snow blowers or things like that, but that's it. Uh

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and then you have the actual elevations are at the top of the sheet. Uh what I'm pointing to on the far left side is the actual garage exterior elevation. Again, it shows the Italianate style as much as possible, but does show little extra detailing. Kind of similar to what

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the Queen Anne style would would propose and kind of what we have on the front porch. We are going to do side hinge doors. They're not going to be true, you know, garage doors going to actually open up, but we're going to put the side hinges in, so it replicates a side hinge door. Okay?

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Um the rest of the the building will be with clapboard siding and corner boards and detailing similar to what your guidelines do require. And so these will be these the four elevations, the front, right side, left side, and then

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>> Quick question. Earlier versions of the application, we saw a much simpler, very, for lack of a better word, sheddy looking Mhm. Rendering. This supersedes that? >> That's correct. >> Good. >> Okay. [laughter] And and is it

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electrified? Is there going to be >> There will be electricity inside the building yes. >> But no lighting on the outside? >> We didn't really discuss that. You were going to have coach lights on the outside or >> I mean, if you're going to electrify it, you know, >> I mean, I I think it would look nice if

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we had two coach lights on the exterior on either side of the >> I'm I'm looking to mimic a carriage house as much as you can. Feel >> We'll put carriage fixtures, carriage light fixtures. >> That'll be great. >> All right. Is the Now, the doors or shutters

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um >> [clears throat] >> on the uh half level above the garage door, are those functional or >> No, there's no shutters. These are just >> No, the triangle >> Looking at the uh >> elevation on your far left. Yeah. >> That elevation right there that you're pointing to. Is that functional or is

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that just >> These are double hung windows, long thin windows in the upper space. >> Okay. >> Okay. Yeah, they're not going to be shutters. I know your requirement does require functional shutters. Which is similar to the style back in the back in the time, but we didn't put any shutters in this space.

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>> Yeah, I just I couldn't tell my reading of the rendering. I couldn't tell whether that was two closed shutters or whether they were windows. Either either is >> No, they they're the intention is, you know, just like the garage door will have glass on the top. >> Yeah. >> Um with mullions, you know, breaking it

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up, you know, in the style. We're going to do the same thing for windows above. >> Okay. >> And in the And in the door, the only other feature that we have on the that garage would be a man door on the side. Um and that would be a panel door with glass on the top.

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>> Panel door, is that a fiberglass door? Or what's the material of of the >> My intention is it's it's a wood door. >> And what's what material is are the garage door made of? >> The garage The garage door we can this garage door actually made up where it's actually has a fiberglass back, but

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there's wood on the exterior. And that's what we're going to do. It's going to have a It's not quite a veneer. It's actually thicker than the veneer. It has like an inch thick. But for all intents and purposes on the exterior, it definitely is a wood door, but we'll get the insulating qualities of the fiberglass that's insulated

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behind it. >> And this is a conventional masonry foundation right? >> It'll be conventionally, you know, cast you know, it would be all reinforced concrete for the you know, floor on a concrete footing and wall and then we would build

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with framing above that. >> Okay, much better than the first person. >> Yes. >> Yes, much better. I also agree. You know, it's interesting um not necessarily I don't know if it makes it any less historic looking, but you know, the windows on that are facing

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the fence Right. I mean, I'm I'm speaking for the homeowner cuz I put a garage in as as well. You know, you're losing valuable you you have a 14-ft wide garage that can fit one car and you can kind of squeeze around. You're losing valuable shelf life on that wall.

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You know, it's almost personally you know better off not to have the windows facing the fence. You know what I mean? Because you're staring at a fence and you're losing wall space where you could put a bunch of junk that you don't want in your basement. >> practical about >> So, practically speaking, that's all I'm

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saying. >> the most value out of the windows if you put them on the on the yard side. Sound off. >> You know, um that's just a suggestion. >> On the right side when it when you're looking at from the street on the right cuz the sun will always be coming in

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from there. >> That'll be coming in from that side. That's correct. >> On the left. >> Well, this this side the south side is is obviously this property line. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> And these are those windows would be actually located here. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Yeah, that's where >> And it would be on the south side. >> Yeah, on the south side.

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>> I mean, personally in the middle of the day if you had no windows at all, you got to turn lights on them in order to see when you go into even a garage. You know so >> They do have >> lights, you know, there I mean, I I personally like the windows there, but Yeah, with the lights coming in from the other side. You got some natural light,

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ventilation. It's to me it's nicer feature, but again, it's my clients could do whatever they like, you know. >> I agree. >> Yeah. >> [laughter] >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> And then there was no other zoning issue with respect to lot coverage. They were extending the driveway and putting an

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apron in and >> That's right. >> things shown up those all those calculations for it doesn't have to go to zoning. I'm only asking cuz I'm on the zoning board, too. >> It's going to be gravel. You're going to continue to gravel path, right? >> Uh we were thinking of you know, we were going to put asphalt, but we you know, he already has bluestone in the front

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and he has the stone in the back. We're going to keep with that theme. >> Yeah. Just Just be careful with the bluestone >> is a thing from my drawings. Yeah, we already discussed that. So, that was something that we definitely shouldn't have had on the drawing. >> Right. Right.

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So, do you need a vote on this? >> Would you Yeah. I'm fine to say anything. It's up to you. >> Yeah. Well, it's up to you. >> Want to say hi? Do you like to say hi? >> Hi. Scott Scott and Denise Breslow. We lived in Red Bank for a long time in multiple properties. Went to Highlands

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for 10 years. And now we're back in our mother country. >> Welcome back. >> Welcome back. >> Yes, it's a beautiful home. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> So, I'll make a motion to approve. >> Well, is he at the end of the application Is that the end of the testimony? Yeah.

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Okay. >> All right. So, you >> I'll make the motion to approve it. >> Motion. Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Rosemary Almarini? >> Approve. >> Ardyce Cavalier? >> Yes.

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>> Paul Cardinal? >> Yes. >> Harris Melscoff? >> Yes. >> And Betsy Balera? >> Approve. >> Thank you for your effort. >> I want to thank you for your time. Thank you very much. >> Thank you. This is uh

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very nice. I think you'll be very happy with it. Much happier with this than >> Yeah, I I just may stop by to see it when it's done. I'm known to do that. >> [laughter] >> I'm known to do that. >> Thank you. >> Okay. All right. So, uh I guess I'm up for

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>> historic preservation conference? >> Okay. So, um Matthew went for two days and Uh ready? Oh okay. So, Matthew went for two days. So, I'm going to mention some of his things. I

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just was a, if you remember, a panel member with uh Cape May and Steven on the panel. So, uh you're going to think this sounds silly silly, but I I felt really proud of our little Red Bank being on the same

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panel with uh Cape May, you know, cuz they're so known for historic preservation. So, and actually, I think I got more attention than they did because more people could identify with what we were trying to do here in in Red Bank and be more fluid in our design

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requirements. So, I think it went very well. So, I'm just going to read for the record, and I think this was sent to you, but just for the public's benefit. So, um on the keynote panel the day before, uh a suggestion for towns and

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municipalities is um to convene a plans and permits open house at some point at one of your meetings just to kind of add it to the agenda, plan for it. So, this way uh kind of open arms, if

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anybody is considering doing anything, just um come and talk about it and make that our agenda if especially if we don't have much going on in terms of other things. Um when it comes to promoting the work of an HPC,

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uh meet people where they are in terms of information, um oral histories are particularly persuasive. So, in terms of the design guidelines that I sat on, it was a lot of Q&A and

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just describing what we did. Uh Steven brought copies of our survey and our design guidelines. Uh Cape May guidelines were already there. Sorry. Was there a question? Oh. Okay. Um so, unlike Cape May,

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um a lot of the municipalities like the fact that ours were available on Amazon if they didn't want to just use online or print out their own copy. Um so, that that was something that other

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municipalities that already had the design guidelines were going to look into. So, it it was very I think everybody was very welcoming uh and it was well received. So, then there was a panel for complying

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with public law um which is a new requirement. So, this is this is new even if you don't go for uh a CLG. And that uh all members are required to complete some kind of education requirement.

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Uh it falls under the Department of Community Affairs. The costs are respons- the responsibility of the municipality. And um so, key aspects of the training will be

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land use in New Jersey, administration and meeting practices, and historic preservation principles. And so, some of these will be offered fall and winter, so we should really keep an eye on those.

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And uh towns that achieve the CLG status can use NJHPO as a resource for technical assistance. Um several of the attendees said that the CLG application was not as difficult as

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we've been led to believe in the past. Reminding us that to apply for grants, we could get 15 to 50,000 dollars. Um Maplewood, New Jersey benefited over 20 years in getting 250,000

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dollars in grants. So, uh grant money may be used for historic preservation, uh brick-and-mortar projects. One of the things that I saw on my recent travel on the Ohio River there in

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um Madison, Indiana, the HPC actually purchased a building and was converting it into a community space. The panel suggested sponsoring an event for visibility, emphasizing the need for

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communication between HPCs, planning, and zoning boards. Okay. So, uh any questions? It's always a fun event. It's good for networking, so if people haven't been, they may want to

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plan to attend next year's. They They move them around the state. So, the first one I went to was in Jersey City. This one was in Morristown. >> Are there any um upcoming events? >> No No more conferences, but um yeah,

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that I know of. So. >> Uh thank you. >> Okay. >> Uh I believe there's nothing on the agenda for new business. >> Yeah, public comments are next. >> Any public comments, questions?

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>> Oh, that's going to be your money. That's not quite see. So, >> There was wasn't there just a meeting on that a couple of >> Yes, there was. >> Is that Is that planning board? >> So, because

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>> Shawna, we can't hear you. If you can turn on your mic. >> Oh, sorry. We have a member in the audience who was is here for a planning board meeting um mistaken the time and date.

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Um I was just explaining to him that um because the planning board and zoning board operate as quasi judicial um entities within the municipality, um we can't read your statement um

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because the applicant has a right to question you or you know, do any type of cross-examination. Um so, you'd have to be here in person to give your statement, but I'm pretty sure this is it's not going to be the final meeting um

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that is the ninth. I'm I'm pretty sure of that. So, there'll probably be an another opportunity um another meeting day for you to give your um your comment, okay? Just um make sure you pay attention to the

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bureau website um under minutes and agenda and you'll see what's on the agenda. So, you you know, make sure that you don't miss it. Okay? So, just it's right there on the calendar and if you um under minutes and agenda, you'll see all the agendas for

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the um different meetings, okay? And if anything, you could contact the planning and zoning office and we'll be able to tell you. You're welcome. >> Sorry I had to sit through. >> Come back anytime. >> Thank you. >> Do you live in a historic home? Oh.

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Oh. Uh-huh. All right. >> Thank you. Okay. >> Beth. >> I need to do I do do I have a motion? >> Hold on. >> Thank you. Do we have a second?

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>> From the peanut gallery, maybe? >> I'll second. >> All right. Karen's second. >> Thank goodness. >> I >> I >> Thank you, everyone. Appreciate you. >> Thank you. Bye. >> Thank you. Bye. All righty.

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So, you'll be around for August, right? >> Right.